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View Full Version : LST Making the most of low yielders



dekay
02-04-11, 04:17 PM
never grown nothing me.

Grub
02-04-11, 04:21 PM
Nice post mate, i'm sure it will help a lot of members increase their yield. :)

dekay
02-04-11, 04:26 PM
Well i topped for so long and it isnt the most efficient of techniques you have to grow the stems back as they were before or u will suffer, and this takes a very long time, i have experimented now for quite some time with extended veg periods and cutting anything off never makes sense in comparison to not cutting anything off but redirecting the growth instead.:)

Neph
03-04-11, 06:07 AM
Lst is by far my favorite method. Even with super cropping you are damaging the plants, not as bad as topping or fimming, but it's still getting damaged and must repair itself.

Lst is really the only way to not damage your plants what so ever.

iice
06-04-11, 03:08 AM
thanks man, very interesting read, im gona give this a go for sure

mellowman
07-04-11, 05:25 PM
I've just lst'd one of my plants because I've got some clones some weeks behind it.

OldTokerVirginGrower
21-04-11, 10:04 PM
Thanks for that geezer. I should have read this before I topped another 2 of my plants this evening thinking they'll outgrow the head height. I'll give this a go. They're all about a foot high. Is this still OK?

taylor
22-04-11, 03:27 AM
I've been lst'ing on my plants of late and quite pleased with the results, looks a bit unnatural to have a plant growing sideways up but gives good results for sure.

Goodbuddy
22-04-11, 10:04 AM
...Using LST...will mean the transport system of the plant will not become narrower but will benefit from the thickness increases


mmmmm I wonder if this would work on my male member, it's not exactly a low yielder and I have the progeny to prove that, but I'm sure the missus would appreciate a stronger, thicker stem LOL

peace:p

white widow
22-04-11, 11:09 AM
Great info mate, cheers bud.

Cheddar
10-05-11, 07:27 PM
thank you for this info :)

dekay
11-05-11, 12:33 PM
Thought i better finish this off, heres the Black Rose ready to flower with lots of tops but never been cut.:)
http://www.thctalk.com/gallery/data/2007/medium/brstartflower.jpg

Diply
11-05-11, 12:50 PM
looking good, will be interesting to compare to topped one - did you dry and weigh that one?

GrassHopper
11-05-11, 01:12 PM
I like Supercropping too! Deffo works the treat. I haven't used that method this time round though as I found the supercropped ones tended to need more of something I could not put my finger on.

So, while were on the subject, anyone tell me: What is it that plants need supplementing with after a supercrop? Or in other words what nutrient do they use to produce auxins?

dekay
15-05-11, 01:50 PM
I like Supercropping too! Deffo works the treat. I haven't used that method this time round though as I found the supercropped ones tended to need more of something I could not put my finger on.

So, while were on the subject, anyone tell me: What is it that plants need supplementing with after a supercrop? Or in other words what nutrient do they use to produce auxins?

The plant isnt doing anything different, the hormones are released anyway but to the tips, but i suppose the extra growth means the growing process puts more strain on the plants reserves so grow nutes should sustain it, I havent noticed any difference myself but I still repot and just tie it back down.

TODrider
25-07-11, 03:47 PM
Great post. I love LST.

RedWhiteBlueGreen
26-08-11, 11:58 AM
Great post & pics thanks, but just to clarify - did u say that u untie the plants for when they hit flowering??

I tied a real stretchy plant of mine down about 5/6 weeks ago & the side branches have brilliantly all turned into main stems as u said. I've then started them on 12/12 about 2 weeks ago & flowers are forming but is it best that i untie it now, let it go back to normal upright position & just use string supports to hold up the new bigger side branches so they dont flop down?? I.e if i do untie it & support the new floppy side branches to stay upright, will the plant produce a mini-cola on these new side ones & also one back on the original main stem??

Thanks in advance!

cannamancan
26-08-11, 01:44 PM
top thread dekay :)

dekay
29-08-11, 09:00 PM
Great post & pics thanks, but just to clarify - did u say that u untie the plants for when they hit flowering??

I tied a real stretchy plant of mine down about 5/6 weeks ago & the side branches have brilliantly all turned into main stems as u said. I've then started them on 12/12 about 2 weeks ago & flowers are forming but is it best that i untie it now, let it go back to normal upright position & just use string supports to hold up the new bigger side branches so they dont flop down?? I.e if i do untie it & support the new floppy side branches to stay upright, will the plant produce a mini-cola on these new side ones & also one back on the original main stem??

Thanks in advance!

You dont need to untie it, I vegged long enough the space where the branches would have been had been filled by the larger side branches so they couldnt return to start, you wont develop the plant any more in flower most of the energy is used for the flowers.

sqydro
30-08-11, 10:07 AM
I like tge look of that mate, so all i do is tie the main growth tip down, and any other branches that start fighting for the main spot after the tie down until im happy with the amount of colas ive got then 12/12 and release all the tied down bits?

Could you put a fully flowered pic of a lst'd plant up for us dekay? Cheers nice info also, defo good for us who are doing 4 big plants in fear of the plod!!

dekay
30-08-11, 08:44 PM
I like tge look of that mate, so all i do is tie the main growth tip down, and any other branches that start fighting for the main spot after the tie down until im happy with the amount of colas ive got then 12/12 and release all the tied down bits?

Could you put a fully flowered pic of a lst'd plant up for us dekay? Cheers nice info also, defo good for us who are doing 4 big plants in fear of the plod!!

Heres the one I made earlier.:)
http://www.thctalk.com/gallery/data/2007/brcomp03.jpg

sqydro
30-08-11, 09:48 PM
Mate that is one stunning plant!! Is that a heaths BR? also was my understanding of LST correct that i posted or am i missing the point completely? Whats your av veg time using this method dekay? And what do they tend to yield, that pic looks like 6 main colas all on 1 plant, beautifull mate!!

dekay
31-08-11, 12:00 PM
Mate that is one stunning plant!! Is that a heaths BR? also was my understanding of LST correct that i posted or am i missing the point completely? Whats your av veg time using this method dekay? And what do they tend to yield, that pic looks like 6 main colas all on 1 plant, beautifull mate!!

Yeah thats the Black Rose and yeah you got it you tie main tip down (support in opposite direction as well) and keep doing it till all the side branches has taken over and become equal.:)

sqydro
31-08-11, 08:29 PM
Sweet mate al see u at the potm in a few month for a lst'd mutant hydro beast!!!

Marley13
01-09-11, 07:10 AM
Like the sound of this thread shall read when i get home

cannamancan
01-09-11, 07:15 AM
My br is nearly 2 weeks into 12/12, I started bending the branches out last week and have noticed the difference all ready , Massivemick came round last night and said "look at all them shoots just appearing there's loads"! So even though I've not tied it down I'm still definitely gaining through lst:) she just looks bushier all round tbf:)

If I hadnt have seen this thread I would have just left her to her own devices but I'm glad I didn't :)

Cheers dekay ;)

Diddydon
11-10-11, 05:22 PM
great info n pics...... cheer dekay..
dd ;)

Mr-Lover
03-02-12, 08:55 PM
Excellent Info Mate :D

Mr-Lover
02-03-12, 11:14 AM
excellent LST Guide Mate Sure it we Help me And Alot of Other :) Thanks
THC

Iration
03-03-12, 02:45 PM
i'll try it in my next grow!! :)
thanx

kodi
04-03-12, 07:51 AM
How long does this process take??? I have 6 regs been vegging for about 3 weeks from seed. Im goin on holiday in June so im cutting it fine to get them ready by then. I was only going to grow them normally due to the time i have, but if im able to want to try LST.
Any tips on if i should or shouldnt do anything with them.

Was planning to flower them after 4 weeks of veg????

Gheko
04-03-12, 05:08 PM
Very helpful thread. Cheers!!

Derty
22-06-12, 09:07 PM
Thanks man verry good knowledge to have ive just started experimenting with topping and super croping didnt know about lst but makes alot more sence :)

crondolissarice
06-09-12, 04:07 AM
god i cant wait to have and indoor set up so i can LST the hell outa some fine ladies

scooby73
23-01-13, 06:40 PM
Been reading on LST today and then seen a news article on the internet today regarding willow trees, seems like it's quite similar.

Wind in the Willows Boosts Biofuel Production: Trees Grown Diagonally Produce Five Times More Biofuel
Jan. 18, 2013 — Willow trees cultivated for 'green energy' can yield up to five times more biofuel if they grow diagonally, compared with those that are allowed to grow naturally up towards the sky.

This effect had been observed in the wild and in plantations around the UK, but scientists were previously unable to explain why some willows produced more biofuel than others.

Now British researchers have identified a genetic trait that causes this effect and is activated in some trees when they sense they are at an angle, such as where they are blown sideways in windy conditions.

The effect creates an excess of strengthening sugar molecules in the willows' stems, which attempt to straighten the plant upwards. These high-energy sugars are fermented into biofuels when the trees are harvested in a process that currently needs to be more efficient before it can rival the production of fossil fuels.

Willow is cultivated widely across the UK, destined to become biofuels for motor vehicles, heating systems and industry. The researchers say that in the future all willow crops could be bred for this genetic trait, making them a more productive and greener energy source.

The study was led by Dr Nicholas Brereton and Dr Michael Ray, both from the Department of Life Sciences at Imperial College London, who worked with researchers at Rothamsted Research, and the University of the Highlands and Islands' Agronomy Institute (at Orkney College UHI). The study is published in the journal Biotechnology for Biofuels.

Dr Brereton said: "We've known for some time that environmental stresses can cause trees to naturally develop a slightly modified 'reaction wood’ and that it can be easier to release sugars from this wood. This is an important breakthrough, our study now shows that natural genetic variations are responsible for these differences and this could well be the key to unlocking the future for sustainable bioenergy from willow.”

The researchers conducted a trial in controlled laboratory conditions on a rooftop in central London at the Gro-dome facility at Imperial's South Kensington Campus. They cultivated some willows at an angle of 45 degrees, and looked for any genetic differences between these plants and those allowed to grow naturally straight upwards.

The team then looked for the same effect with willows growing in natural conditions on Orkney Island, off the northern-most coast of Scotland, where winds are regularly so strong that the trees are constantly bent over at severe angles. Their measurements confirmed that the willows here could release five times more sugar than identical trees grown in more sheltered conditions at Rothamsted Research in the south of the UK.

Dr Angela Karp at Rothamsted Research who leads the BBSRC-funded BSBEC-BioMASS project said “We are very excited about these results because they show that some willows respond more to environmental stresses, such as strong winds, by changing the composition of their wood in ways that are useful to us. As breeders this is good news because it means we could improve willow by selecting these types from the huge diversity in our collections”.

This work forms part of the BBSRC Sustainable Bioenergy Centre (BSBEC) where it is linked with other programmes aimed at improving the conversion of biomass to fuels. Coupled with work at Rothamsted Research, where the National Willow Collection is held, the new results will help scientists to grow biofuel crops in climatically challenging conditions where the options for growing food crops are limited, therefore minimising conflicts of food versus fuel.

MrG
10-02-13, 01:59 PM
Very nice I feel ready to try on next crop.

Thanks for the info delay.

gxkon
16-02-13, 08:02 PM
I didnt even know you can do this ima do it with all my plants thanx for this guide dekay

Google that ish!!!!!!!

Fieldy
18-02-13, 08:33 PM
Thanks dekay... iv just LST'd for the first time tonight :) hopefully it will help my plants as they were a little stretched !


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 2

dekay
19-02-13, 04:54 PM
Thanks dekay... iv just LST'd for the first time tonight :) hopefully it will help my plants as they were a little stretched !


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 2

Hope it goes well mate but it will plants love being tied down.:)

stonedkiwi
19-03-13, 11:35 PM
very helpful thanks

bundyblae1
08-09-13, 12:24 PM
Cant wait to try this dekay will my cheese plants love this method and when should I start my plants are only young

greenthumb123
08-09-13, 12:47 PM
Hello dekay, great post mate. I don't know how to transfer a pic from thread to thread but if you look on my Sugar Peak nutes thread there is a pic of an 8 Ball Kush which I topped once and then used l.s.t. to keep her low. In the end, just before flowering she was 4-5 inches tall from soil level, 18 inches wide and had 30+ growing heads. I prefer the l.s.t. to topping as I feel it causes the plant a-lot less stress and also resumes growing much quicker.:D

eyelikeurbud
23-10-13, 05:02 PM
I can't wait to do this to my ladies! But I do have a question. When are they ready to venture off into ganja bondage? My ladies are about 3 weeks now, and have been recently re-potted. When would be ideal to start this?

dekay
26-10-13, 11:19 PM
I can't wait to do this to my ladies! But I do have a question. When are they ready to venture off into ganja bondage? My ladies are about 3 weeks now, and have been recently re-potted. When would be ideal to start this?

Yeah thats fine mate as long as you anchor it to opposite of pot then there will be no strain on the roots just the plant :)

dekay
26-10-13, 11:22 PM
Cant wait to try this dekay will my cheese plants love this method and when should I start my plants are only young

It depends on growth of plant you want an established root system but if they can be bent gently down then they should be fine, have a play and find out what works is best advice canna plants recover pretty good, and dont do seedlings they do not like the stem to be even touched, i do prefer using cuts for LST as they are hardened off.

BigBudBuddah
09-01-14, 07:40 AM
Thanks for the info! I'm definitely going to LST this first round of plants.

lowreypants
16-01-14, 02:08 AM
Don't do seedlings? When does a seedling become erm, a plant?
Or just NEVER do plants grown from seed?

Dave-Hester
16-01-14, 07:53 AM
Don't do seedlings? When does a seedling become erm, a plant?
Or just NEVER do plants grown from seed?

0-2 weeks from seed is seeding

2-6 weeks small vegging plant

6-12 week shrub/tree

BobMarle
27-01-14, 10:02 PM
Great post, looking forward to putting these techniques into practice next week when I pick up my 3 seedlings!! :weed:

dekay
29-01-14, 12:05 PM
Great post, looking forward to putting these techniques into practice next week when I pick up my 3 seedlings!! :weed:

It adds a bit of fun as well you get quite addicted to bending and shaping them how you want.:)

BudMan
29-01-14, 12:09 PM
Excellent guide Dekay. Really informative. This is exactly how I train my plants as well. Tying down the biggest branches to the pot lip the supercropping everything into place.

:)

dekay
29-01-14, 12:14 PM
Excellent guide Dekay. Really informative. This is exactly how I train my plants as well. Tying down the biggest branches to the pot lip the supercropping everything into place.

:)

It all get those auxins going :)

lowreypants
30-01-14, 12:41 AM
0-2 weeks from seed is seeding

2-6 weeks small vegging plant

6-12 week shrub/tree

Bunda? Can you LST an auto grown from seed once roots are established? 😣

Dave-Hester
30-01-14, 08:37 AM
Bunda? Can you LST an auto grown from seed once roots are established? 😣

Yes mate I give them their 2 week grace as a seedling then bend the top growth tip using a tent peg or something so the lower shoots can have a little catch up then release the peg/pegs after about 10 days and then let them fly :dance2:

Best of luck

bigbadbillybob
31-01-14, 01:11 AM
i lst my autos when they get to the 5th node.
They love it

lowreypants
31-01-14, 11:56 PM
Bunda, have you dropped in on my fridge grow? I'm wanting to bend 'Em from front to back.

Dave-Hester
01-02-14, 08:07 AM
Bunda, have you dropped in on my fridge grow? I'm wanting to bend 'Em from front to back.

Post a link mate. I might have seen it. I can't go looking for stuff on tapatalk I not 100% sure how to use it

lowreypants
01-02-14, 10:48 PM
Oh right. I'll have a go in the sober morning.

lowreypants
01-02-14, 10:49 PM
http://www.thctalk.com/cannabis-forum/showthread.php?t=110539
Fingers crossed.

lowreypants
04-02-14, 09:46 AM
Yes mate I give them their 2 week grace as a seedling then bend the top growth tip using a tent peg or something so the lower shoots can have a little catch up then release the peg/pegs after about 10 days and then let them fly :dance2:

Best of luck

When you say "let them fly" they will now be happily grown parallel to the ground. Remove the pegs and the end will turn up and various bud sites will develop along the main stem? In theory 👊 will these buds need any support? Or just judge it like you would with tomatoes say?

lowreypants
28-02-14, 12:08 PM
Plants grow to the light bb.

dekay
28-02-14, 01:15 PM
Hopefully this isn't too dumb of a question... But why don't we just plant the seedling at like a 60 degree angle in the soil so we don't have to do all the serious beginning in LST? Wouldn't that just make the plant angles right off the bat and avoid the plant having to adapt? I know you'd still have to tie down parts, but maybe not the stalk? I'm sure there's a simple reason, I'm just a newb learning and couldn't think of a reason

The plant sends auxins (growth hormone) to the uppermost point so bending the stalk to below branches means the auxins are sent to the new uppermost part or parts meaning a larger growth spurt. Also the resistance makes the plant stronger with thicker branches meaning better transfer of nutrients through the plant.:)

dekay
28-02-14, 02:59 PM
Ahhh, so it's the actual stress of the bend that makes the nute transfer better, ok gotcha, thanks guys

The plant thinks its lost part of it when its bended so sort of yes :)

dekay
28-02-14, 08:15 PM
Would putting real slight bend on it do the same? Like planting at an angle and then a real easy bend? Or does the bend need to be at the higher end of LST to illicit the correct plant reaction?

As long as you change the uppermost part of the plant it will work as the majority of the auxins travel to the highest point however this is achieved.

lowreypants
28-02-14, 09:55 PM
Looks like I totally misunderstood the question bb. Sorry dude.

Bulls
04-04-15, 12:03 PM
never grown nothing me.

Is it only me or that's everything I can see on the 1st post ? Seems all the information is missing..

Baker Man
07-05-15, 07:22 AM
Is it only me or that's everything I can see on the 1st post ? Seems all the information is missing..

No its not just you. The whole first post seems to have been vaped!
BM

keepitgreen
12-05-15, 08:25 PM
a lot of the posts was removed when raggs sold out, loads of members left, threads, posts was removed, it all happen over a couple of weeks

this was a different place a few years back, it slowly when down hill.

Greenthum
20-01-17, 07:36 PM
Why is this Tutorial Deleted?

M_C
20-02-17, 03:00 PM
Why is this Tutorial Deleted?

Dekay decided to delete it when he left the forum... that was nice of him!