View Full Version : 12/12 or 8/8/8
was pissed one night looking on the utube found a fella that swears by the 8/8/8 light cycle (can not find it now ) has any1 tried it i know they wont get as big but i grow 12/12 anyway think he said he got his crop down to 39 days
Mr Swilly
19-09-11, 06:49 PM
I suspect he was growing an auto, a non auto plant needs 12 hours dark for flowering.
teutonic
19-09-11, 07:06 PM
was pissed one night looking on the utube found a fella that swears by the 8/8/8 light cycle (can not find it now ) has any1 tried it i know they wont get as big but i grow 12/12 anyway think he said he got his crop down to 39 days
8/8/8 ? An interesting concept. Hope someone knows
I suspect he was growing an auto, a non auto plant needs 12 hours dark for flowering.
dont think it was mate think a normal seeds but can not realy remember ,i just thought like 12/12 u are conning it maybe 8/8/8 was same but quicker i dont know only on my 3rd grow
but allreaady found out ghs company are not the best from 7, 3 are dead afta sprouting ,3 are nice , and is about 4 foot tall
teutonic
19-09-11, 07:41 PM
dont think it was mate think a normal seeds but can not realy remember ,i just thought like 12/12 u are conning it maybe 8/8/8 was same but quicker i dont know only on my 3rd grow
but allreaady found out ghs company are not the best from 7, 3 are dead afta sprouting ,3 are nice , and is about 4 foot tall
if i ever get the stash to fek about, i'll do an 8/8/8 on the cfl's and diary a report
Slow and steady wins the race
trumptummy
19-09-11, 07:48 PM
if i ever get the stash to fek about, i'll do an 8/8/8 on the cfl's and diary a report
I might do a bonsai 8/8/8 after i move.. might aswel..
Murdock
19-09-11, 07:52 PM
sounds interesting, i would,nt mind trying by starting from 18/6 in veg and cutting an hour off every week until you get to 12/12 then take 1/2 hour off every week until finished
Mr Swilly
19-09-11, 08:15 PM
dont think it was mate think a normal seeds but can not realy remember ,i just thought like 12/12 u are conning it maybe 8/8/8 was same but quicker i dont know only on my 3rd grow
but allreaady found out ghs company are not the best from 7, 3 are dead afta sprouting ,3 are nice , and is about 4 foot tall
I can totally understand increasing plant days in veg as there is no risk of it flowering. But ive never seen anyone anywhere say that you can flower a regular seed in anything under 10 hours dark, with 12/12 being the tried and tested approach to flowering.
Notorious WD
19-09-11, 09:02 PM
I can totally understand increasing plant days in veg as there is no risk of it flowering. But ive never seen anyone anywhere say that you can flower a regular seed in anything under 10 hours dark, with 12/12 being the tried and tested approach to flowering.
bang on the money swilly. I have heard of 14/10 plants in killing fields which dekay grew but any less is ??? ask wert.
easterbunny
19-09-11, 09:20 PM
you should look up 18hr light cycles bud, its sumit I've been thinking about. from Wat I've read it cuts the flowering time rite down and also the yield but if you use a good co2 unit you can pull the same yield you would get with the normal light cycle and no co2 but in a shorter time.
6 on 12 off
DangerDragon
19-09-11, 11:49 PM
you should look up 18hr light cycles bud, its sumit I've been thinking about. from Wat I've read it cuts the flowering time rite down and also the yield but if you use a good co2 unit you can pull the same yield you would get with the normal light cycle and no co2 but in a shorter time.
6 on 12 off
this might be a silly question, but how do you go about setting you're timer to be on a 18hr cycle?
DangerDragon
20-09-11, 12:00 AM
done some google searching about the 18 hour cycle & found this & thought i would share a interesting read,
from a different chonging forum copy & pasted lol
Growing with an 18 hour Day/Night Cycle
The theory behind the 18 hour Day/Night cycle is that during a normal 24 hour light cycle plants will usually achieve high growth rates peaking at 100% capacity during the first 50 - 60% of the day. The growth rates will then diminish rapidly and the last 20 - 30% of the day achieves minimal growth. So by reducing the length of the day we are triggering an increased growth mode where the growth rates are at their peak for the majority of the day. This effectively achieves a very fast growth cycle with full yield potential.
NOTE: To achieve these incredible growth rates it is important to provide maximum light intensities and CO2 enriched conditions. The recommended lighting is 600W per square metre.
The Cycles
Vegetative Cycle -
Lights ON 14 hours
Lights OFF 4 hours
Flowering Cycle -
Lights ON 6 hours
Lights OFF 12 hours
The Benefits
The growth during an 18 hour cycle can be the equivalent to that achieved during a 24 hour cycle. So by running 18 hour cycles the same growth and yield can be achieved in 75% of the time. Reduced day lengths also mean reduced power consumption. Grow more and use less power. Who can argue with that?
For example, an average crop grown from seed using a 24 hour day/night cycle will have a 4 weeks grow cycle and an 8 weeks flower cycle. This equates to 28 days @ 18 hours a day and 56 days @ 12 hours a day = 1176 hours of light over 12 weeks.
An accelerated crop using an 18 hour day/night cycle will achieve the same yields using a 3 week grow cycle and a 6 week flower cycle. This equates to 21 days @ 14 hours a day and 42 days @ 6 hours a day = 546 hours of light over 9 weeks resulting in a 40% reduction in power consumption and a 25% reduction in crop time.
Crop rotations in 7.5 weeks (down from 16weeks)
Getting efficient output is what it’s all about. I have to be at least a little dubious. But try this for size... I have to think that there’s something to it.
All species of plant, insect or animal on earth have their "Day period" during which, their efficiency is greater for SOME of that time. While they can use up to 18hrs of light, maybe for 12 of those, they are at 100%, then drift off to only 60%-70%, then to 20%-30%. Consider... most days we wake up and are at 90% in 5 minutes, at 100% in 10 minutes. After 10/12 hrs, we’re flagging badly and while happy to stay up another 6-8 hrs, are just "laidback". A young kid on the other hand, is at 90% within 10 seconds of waking and 100% in 30 seconds. They hit the wall "like a bird flying into plate glass" after 14 hrs, then sleep like a brick for 10! Others however, take an hour to get to 60%, another hour to get to 90%.
Plants don’t think, they react to a genetic 'drive to survive'. So, I conclude that there is a case to examine where a short day cycle could trip a plant's genetic response into a "survive or die" accelerated mode to flowering and fruiting. The idea is to capture the hours that would give 90% or better, of the plant's "production" but maybe saving 25-30% of the daylight period (power being a special consideration).
Set vegetative cycle at 14hrs day and 4hrs night for an 18hr day
Run it for 7 days (about 10 "plant days") at 2000ppm CO2
That period gives sufficient leaf development to proceed with the flowering phase.
The "Fast Flower" 6hr days and 12hr nights regime lasts 45 days.
Crop is better than EVER had in 16 weeks." Yields?, "I’d say 135-140% of previous best crops.
7weeks and 3 days Harvest. Impressive result. 6 great crops a year, low management of them and every one a winner!
The claims Leaf phase (light hrs) Flowering phase Total
1. Non CO2 4wks (28days @18hrs) ,12wks (84days @12 hrs) =16wks (1512hrs)
378 lights ON hrs/mth.
2. "Short Cycle" 7day (10cycle@14hr), 45day (60days @6 hrs) =7.4wks (500hrs)
Unbelievable result! Easy harvest and growth. 250 lights ON hrs/mth. Great result, especially that the grow room/crop management is also massively reduced.
3. Std CO2 cycle: 2wks (14days @18hrs), 10wks (70days @12 hrs) =12wks (1092hrs)
Fantastic crop. 364 lights ON hrs/mth. Easy harvest. Supporting evidence.
Indicated power usage for the short phase growing cycle reduces to about 250hrs/mth, from 378hrs/mth, a drop of 33%!
Power usage dropped to 66%, a saving of 34% (from $500/mth to around $328/mth).
This had a consequential effect of reducing residual heat in the room, nutrient and water tanks, with profound effects reducing mould and fungus problems.
These figures just blow me away. The total "light ON" period of 500hrs to get a harvest is amazing. That is only 2/3rds of the time and 50% of power that a regular CO2 equipped growing operation is using. In just 1/2 of the time at 1/3rd of the power, a better harvest than ever achieved with a 16week method.
For the flower seeds he is cropping, he has hit a crop rotation and growing efficiency that would make most people's eyes water.
Good luck to him.
Hope that this is of interest to all in Home Growing Heaven
Goodbuddy
20-09-11, 12:14 AM
...but ive never seen anyone anywhere say that you can flower a regular seed in anything under 10 hours dark....
Obv' there is only one way to be sure.
But consider this......
Do plants flower because they count 12hours of darkness or do they flower because the build up of vegging hormone in the daytime is not enough to counter the flowering hormone produced at night. I thought it was a shift in hormone 'balance' due to differing lengths of light exposure that triggered the flowering response ? (leave out equatorials/auto's, I am developing different theories on these)
In which case 8/8 would work provided the corresponding veg photoperiod was based on a 16hour day.
wot 'dyou fink guv lol
lil rasta
24-09-11, 07:56 PM
interesting shit can see the science behind the logic
Diddydon
24-09-11, 09:31 PM
Obv' there is only one way to be sure.
But consider this......
Do plants flower because they count 12hours of darkness or do they flower because the build up of vegging hormone in the daytime is not enough to counter the flowering hormone produced at night. I thought it was a shift in hormone 'balance' due to differing lengths of light exposure that triggered the flowering response ? (leave out equatorials/auto's, I am developing different theories on these)
In which case 8/8 would work provided the corresponding veg photoperiod was based on a 16hour day.
wot 'dyou fink guv lol
Did i read wrong.. i´m sure it says flowering cycle 12hrs off n 6 hrs on... that would make 10 days in a week.. so reducing flowering time.. but.. (6hrs on) surely that wud mean smaller colas.. it does seem to make sense... gonna have to read it again and see if it will sink it to me ol nugget properly..
RedWhiteBlueGreen
25-09-11, 11:55 AM
That sounds well interesting thanks DD - will consider trying that myself very soon.
The one thing it made me think of tho is how u'd need a good programmable timer - something that u can program on a calendar style schedule would be perfect as i cant think of how u could set a normal 24hr timer, without having to change it manually each day. Does anyone know if u can buy calendar style timers at all?? Or any way of linking timers, etc to a PC as control station - that would be perfect then!
Tho i must say, i've never had digi timer, so dunno if i've just asked a question thats about 10 years outta date! (i just assume they work on similiar 24hr to normal mechanical ones, but just in a digi stylee!)
Diddydon
25-09-11, 08:16 PM
u cud do it with a simple digi timer outa asda.. i use 1 now.. it has ten settings on it.. so u would start at say.. 12.00 on..... 18.00off.... 06.00..on... 12.00 off...0.00 on... 06.00 off.. 18.00 on etc.. You know what.. i´m gonna do a side by side comparision when i start my next grow in 4wks.. cos that is the only way we would know for sure... would be fuckin great... if it works and worth the test... 50% less power... 30 % less time!!
Mr Swilly
25-09-11, 10:54 PM
Obv' there is only one way to be sure.
But consider this......
Do plants flower because they count 12hours of darkness or do they flower because the build up of vegging hormone in the daytime is not enough to counter the flowering hormone produced at night. I thought it was a shift in hormone 'balance' due to differing lengths of light exposure that triggered the flowering response ? (leave out equatorials/auto's, I am developing different theories on these)
In which case 8/8 would work provided the corresponding veg photoperiod was based on a 16hour day.
wot 'dyou fink guv lol
I believe the flowering is all to do with the actual length of the dark period. If 8/8 flowers then 16/8 should also flower plants, but it doesn't, well none I have seen anyway. If 8/8 is possible then 1/1 should work as well if it's about hormones. I think 16/16 may work as there is a 12 hr dark period.
I think 12 off 6 on will work, as plants finish outdoors like that,, not sure about yield claims tho. If it is the same, then have us growers been throwing kwh down the drain for decades. I don't think it's likely.
Interesting stuff tho.
I'd love to see the 8/8 thread if anyone's got a link.
hi peeps been trying to find link on the tube but had no luck , never thought this much into it just thought i,d try an speed process up a little will keep hunting for the vid
Goodbuddy
26-09-11, 07:17 PM
If 8/8 is possible then 1/1 should work as well if it's about hormones.
Ahhhh, but there may be the go-to-sleep factor. In that it could take up to 2hrs for the plants to fully, chemically, realise they are in dark, from what I have read. And not sure if there is a converse wake-up period to consider.
But, effing ell, in a 1/1 photoperiod you could grow out an ak47 in about 3 days lol, probably get about 4grams as well :). Now that would be a quick and dirty experiment :)
Goodbuddy
26-09-11, 07:22 PM
I'm sure someone can work out the cumulative maximum available light energy available to the plants for each lighting photoperiod and work out which is most yield efficient over a set time/number of grows.
I always took 12/12 to be a good compromise of energy v efficiency v yield but like you say Swilly, we could all be hoodwinked by the lighting companies :)
teutonic
26-09-11, 07:27 PM
... in a 1/1 photoperiod you could grow out an ak47 in about 3 days lol, probably get about 4grams as well :). Now that would be a quick and dirty experiment :)
hahaha! nice thought
this might be a silly question, but how do you go about setting you're timer to be on a 18hr cycle?
i think a digital timer would be needed ?
Mr Swilly
26-09-11, 07:43 PM
Yeah. Wonder if you could geta strobe light and do an auto in 20 mins lmfbo
I have a sativa in veg stage at the moment under 160w pll.
I don't mind to test it out :-)
Isn't it too late to give her this new light regime ?
Mr Swilly
26-09-11, 07:53 PM
I have a sativa in veg stage at the moment under 160w pll.
I don't mind to test it out :-)
Isn't it too late to give her this new light regime ?
No, not too late, the light schedule is supposed to be for flowering a regular strain.
But I am not encouraging you try it..cos..
1) it won't work
2) it is pure hearsay.
I think it will continue to veg, but get all stretchy.
No, not too late, the light schedule is supposed to be for flowering a regular strain.
But I am not encouraging you try it..cos..
1) it won't work
2) it is pure hearsay.
I think it will continue to veg, but get all stretchy.
I have no clue so don't beat me :-)
Flowering Cycle -
Lights ON 6 hours
Lights OFF 12 hours
Isn't most important 12hours of darkness for flowering ?
Mr Swilly
26-09-11, 08:06 PM
Ah, yeah try that. Sorry thought you were on about doing 8/8.
Not beating you mate, just trying to assist. Only one spanker round here, which is poet (bsc Hons - whips).
easterbunny
26-09-11, 08:08 PM
from wat i've read its 12 houres dark 6 houres light from this you should expect 30-40% loss in yield, so they say a good co2 system should get you back the 30-40% loss in yield.
i've also read about 9hrs on 9hrs off but have not saw any diary on it.
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