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  1. #1141

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    Quote Originally Posted by DrStamets View Post
    This data pretty much answers question 1 too.

    Recording the reason for death is difficult. It could be said that everyone dies from a cardiac arrest, but was it the car impact, or internal bleeding, or an infection after surgery. All are valid and the decision of the doctor at the time.

    Therefore recording the number of deaths within 28 days of a positive test standardises the collection. Not everyone who dies within 28 days will die of C19 but this error will be standardised. It allows a trend to be presented and easily understood.

    With the significant increase in deaths when compared to an average of previous years, what else could it be related to?

    JMO.
    Spot on from my understanding. I totally get that the "within 28 days" thing could be perceived as miss-leading and that, yes, there's the run-over-by-a bus thing that could apply. However, for an 80 year old who has lived for 960 months to die within 28 days of something other than Covid after a positive test is so statistically unlikely as to be irrelevant. Like you say, that anomaly would only be relevant if every death certificate prior to the pandemic had been 100% accurate, which, of course they aren't. "Old age" covers a multitude of nasties, for example. Death certificate "errors" are probably no more or less common than they've ever been which, as you say, standardises the figures.

    I think we're just going to have to face it: they are fucking shocking numbers.
    A "neckbeard, cute dog, pansy-ass fuck" pursuing herb immunity since 1966


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  3. #1142

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    In the States the government pays more money for a coved patient than they do a normal flu or pneumonia patient and if they happen to put you on a ventilator then you really get the big bucks.

    Show me an incentive and I'll show you the results.



    J


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  5. #1143

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    Quote Originally Posted by jingo View Post
    In the States the government pays more money for a coved patient than they do a normal flu or pneumonia patient and if they happen to put you on a ventilator then you really get the big bucks.

    Show me an incentive and I'll show you the results.



    J

    WTF? I mean seriously, what???

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  7. #1144

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    You mean health insurance money, I'm guessing??

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  9. #1145

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  11. #1146

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bud Lightyear View Post
    They all be out clapping on a thursday night again ffs....I've caught the clap of a nurse but never clapped for one

    Regards BL
    FPMSL..."Thanks for last night. Could you drop some antibiotics off on your way home?"

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  13. #1147

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    Quote Originally Posted by jingo View Post
    In the States the government pays more money for a coved patient than they do a normal flu or pneumonia patient and if they happen to put you on a ventilator then you really get the big bucks.

    Show me an incentive and I'll show you the results.



    J

    The US health system is the best in the world, only if you have money.

    Not saying this isn't true but it does sound like a typical anti-covid story without any reference.

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  15. #1148

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    Quote Originally Posted by Herbitual View Post
    WTF? I mean seriously, what???
    No this money comes from the federal government direct, it's a bailout of sorts. If you have a coved patient you get something like $14,000 more for the patient, if they go on a ventilator it's something like 50,000 more. It doesn't matter if it's private pay or insurance it's just extra money to the hospitals.

    We used to get the same kind of stuff when I was involved in youth counseling, they would pay you more if you had a victim of intimate partner violence that was a lesbian. And you know what? We'd go out and find whatever type of clients the current block grant was willing to pay for.







    J


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  17. #1149

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    Quote Originally Posted by DrStamets View Post
    The US health system is the best in the world, only if you have money.

    Not saying this isn't true but it does sound like a typical anti-covid story without any reference.
    Please don't take this as having a go at anyone (and people can't post links as a reference either).

    I'm enjoying this conversation as I do for many topics on this forum.

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  19. #1150

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    Quote Originally Posted by DrStamets View Post
    The US health system is the best in the world, only if you have money.

    Not saying this isn't true but it does sound like a typical anti-covid story without any reference.
    It was all over our news over here when this thing first started, I haven't seen anything truthful in the news and years. But that is exactly what we do here in the US, they'll put together money for small businesses to keep from laying off their employees and it'll all be sucked up by the major corporations. The medical establishment is one of the triad of the oil and chemical industry they control everything here in our country.



    J


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  21. #1151

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    Quote Originally Posted by jingo View Post
    No this money comes from the federal government direct, it's a bailout of sorts. If you have a coved patient you get something like $14,000 more for the patient, if they go on a ventilator it's something like 50,000 more. It doesn't matter if it's private pay or insurance it's just extra money to the hospitals.

    We used to get the same kind of stuff when I was involved in youth counseling, they would pay you more if you had a victim of intimate partner violence that was a lesbian. And you know what? We'd go out and find whatever type of clients the current block grant was willing to pay for.







    J

    Interesting. IMO this is a positive, otherwise these patients would not get treated.

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  23. #1152

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    Quote Originally Posted by DrStamets View Post
    Interesting. IMO this is a positive, otherwise these patients would not get treated.
    In a small town like where I live one patient could possibly bankrupt you, so yes it's very good in that situation. But unfortunately in corporate hospitals in corporate America you get a lot of pressure to look for any reason to diagnose somebody to get that extra 14 grand.



    J


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  25. #1153

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    We also have free coved tests over here at every clinic and hospital in my area, they're not actually free. The organization doing the test gets paid for that money It just doesn't come from the patient. I've worked in healthcare and I've watched the focus shift immediately when new money comes into a different area, it's very much incentive to go out and produce results.



    J


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  27. #1154

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    Regards BL

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  29. #1155

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    Vaccine implies immunity

    These "vaccines" only remove symptoms, you can still catch it or pass it on and it's only a 60odd% chance to work
    And the UK is planning on mixing and matching them

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  31. #1156

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    Quote Originally Posted by Karsa View Post
    Vaccine implies immunity

    These "vaccines" only remove symptoms, you can still catch it or pass it on and it's only a 60odd% chance to work
    And the UK is planning on mixing and matching them

    Sent from my J8210 using Tapatalk
    Yeah there was a little bit of criticism of the UK over that mixing and matching, some suggesting it could cause a risk to the rest of the world.

    The Israelis are farther along in vaccinating their population than anybody else and they have a correlation between vaccinating and increased rates of infection. Not that the vaccines are causing the virus, but that for some short time period you're even more susceptible, so I'm not sure mixing is a very good idea.



    J


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    Stay safe everyone.

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  35. #1158

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    Quote Originally Posted by jingo View Post
    Yeah there was a little bit of criticism of the UK over that mixing and matching, some suggesting it could cause a risk to the rest of the world.

    The Israelis are farther along in vaccinating their population than anybody else and they have a correlation between vaccinating and increased rates of infection. Not that the vaccines are causing the virus, but that for some short time period you're even more susceptible, so I'm not sure mixing is a very good idea.



    J

    To that I'd say that people just need to be more mindful of others and less selfish, but that's applicable across the board in reality.

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  37. #1159

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    Quote Originally Posted by jingo View Post
    It was all over our news over here when this thing first started, I haven't seen anything truthful in the news and years. But that is exactly what we do here in the US, they'll put together money for small businesses to keep from laying off their employees and it'll all be sucked up by the major corporations. The medical establishment is one of the triad of the oil and chemical industry they control everything here in our country.



    J

    I have been trying very hard to stay out of this. People believe what they want too and that is how it should be.
    But I don't understand your saying doctors, hospitals or health care facilities get paid more if it's a covid diagnosis
    because it was on the news but then you say the news has not told the truth about anything in years.
    This has left me scratching my head. Not trying to offend mind you just trying to figure out the rational of those
    statements.

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  39. #1160

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    Quote Originally Posted by Blue61 View Post
    I have been trying very hard to stay out of this. People believe what they want too and that is how it should be.
    But I don't understand your saying doctors, hospitals or health care facilities get paid more if it's a covid diagnosis
    because it was on the news but then you say the news has not told the truth about anything in years.
    This has left me scratching my head. Not trying to offend mind you just trying to figure out the rational of those
    statements.
    Yeah I purposely said I don't trust the news and yes it was in the news. But the truth is we're totally driven by profit over here in the United States, every diagnosis profits somebody and where there's profits there will be results.

    Somewhere about 40 years ago I got road rash on my arm real bad from an accident and the ER put about 12 telfa pads on it. they're just gauze pads that have kind of a nonstick surface to them. They charged me $75 for each one they put on. The The last hospital I worked at people would ask for a box of tissues they get about 50 tissues in a box we charged $12.50 a box.

    I suppose if you live under a system of national health the idea that you could pay $75 for a Band-Aid or $12.50 for a small box of tissues seems crazy.



    J


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