Super Soil (Sort of)

[B1unt]

I am scheming

Stupid questing, if you can start a seedling in a water only soil like Sohum or Ecothrive Eco-life, I am assuming it's not that "hot"?

Therefore would it make sense to, say:

• Start a seedling in a 1L pot of straight potting soil.
• Make a hotter veg focused soil mix (higher EC ) & pot up our hypothetical plant into an 8L container of said soil (Sohum / Ecothrive Eco-Life + Veg fertaliser, a few extra worm castings &/or a light dusting of a no till soil amendment).
  
  
• Finally pot our now well vegged plant into it's final container with the base soil, amended towards flower with dry amendments (or whatever).

Seems like that would be common practice or am I wrong on that

Cheers

[CityDweller]

I am scheming

Stupid questing, if you can start a seedling in a water only soil like Sohum or Ecothrive Eco-life, I am assuming it's not that "hot"?

Therefore would it make sense to, say:

• Start a seedling in a 1L pot of straight potting soil.
• Make a hotter veg focused soil mix (higher EC ) & pot up our hypothetical plant into an 8L container of said soil (Sohum / Ecothrive Eco-Life + Veg fertaliser, a few extra worm castings &/or a light dusting of a no till soil amendment).
  
  
• Finally pot our now well vegged plant into it's final container with the base soil, amended towards flower with dry amendments (or whatever).

Seems like that would be common practice or am I wrong on that

Cheers

I believe that the roots first find the outer edges of the container and then fill in the pot. The soil i use is very hot. If i start in the hot soil i have a small pot sized hole in the center with just buffered coco. This helps the seedling get a little settled before the tap shoots down into the hot soil. Still, these plants grow slower in the beginning and take longer to get comfortable before they take off.

I recently got a pre mixed ammendment called earth dust. They have you cook the soil with their "base" (3-1-2) before starting and then 1 week before flowering they get a top dress with their "boost" (2-3-6) and again 30 days later.

I think Top dressing the flower boosters at the correct times would work better than the layered approach.

Cheers mate.

[Shaun]

As long as you're not too crazy I say start it in your mix.

[B1unt]

I believe that the roots first find the outer edges of the container and then fill in the pot. The soil i use is very hot. If i start in the hot soil i have a small pot sized hole in the center with just buffered coco. This helps the seedling get a little settled before the tap shoots down into the hot soil. Still, these plants grow slower in the beginning and take longer to get comfortable before they take off.

I recently got a pre mixed ammendment called earth dust. They have you cook the soil with their "base" (3-1-2) before starting and then 1 week before flowering they get a top dress with their "boost" (2-3-6) and again 30 days later.

I think Top dressing the flower boosters at the correct times would work better than the layered approach.

Cheers mate.

My main concern is once they're established in their final containers, they'll be getting bottom fed by an Autopot system.

I understand I can keep the top soil moist with a mulch layer or cover crop, but I am not that much of a hippy yet.

As long as you're not too crazy I say start it in your mix.

Are you handing me a rope?

I do plan on inoculating the soil before using it, however if I do that a week before potting up into the final container, if I am not mistaken said additional flowering amendments wouldn't be available for 2-3 weeks


I guess this isn't a common practice then? Does anyone have a link to a good soil EC meter

[sourshoes]

Don't bother with a soil EC (didn't know they existed). It won't really be helpful with a living soil.

Mix your soil and let it rest. When you're planting your seeds in small containers, by the time you're ready to transplant the soil will be ready.

I plant right into my soil with no issues but it's not overloaded with stuff. I just topdress dry amendments a couple times in the grow.

All this to say, follow a soil recipe, use big enough containers and you'll be bored because its so easy. Don't over complicate it. Coots mix is really good if you can get your hands on the materials. Making a veg and bloom soil mix sounds hard to replicate and not worth it. Put all the goodies in and the plant will decide.



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[B1unt]

I am limited in pot size by the containers compatible with the AutoPot system…

I could possibly get around this by running more plants though. The Ecothrive website gives recommendations for a 1.2m² footprint (my tent ) of: 2x 80L pots, 4x 40L pots or 9x 20L pots.

I have 15 & 19L pots, however there is a 25L plastic pot available (as well as a mad 4’x4’ tray system which holds five massive pots that I am not buying ).

Do you think a 19L or 25L pot of straight Ecothrive or Sohum soil would see a plant through an entire cycle - Based on 9x plants, scrogged in a 4’x4’ tent with probably 4 weeks from seed until flip & then 70 days until the chop?


Regarding the amendments Living Soils (living soils fertiliser dot internet) have organic grow Grow & Bloom fertiliser mixes:

Grow:
Key ingredients - EM1 infused bokashi bran, Volcanic rockdust, Mycorrhizal fungi, Alfalfa meal, Mealworm & black soldier fly frass, Wheat bran.

Nutrient analysis
Total Nitrogen (N) .........4.0%
Phosphorous (P) …….....6.0%
Potassium (K) …………….4.0%

In this blend we have added 18 different species of mycorrhizal fungi to assist with reaching and processing all available nutrients in your substrate. We've also added powdered volcanic rockdust (which contains two thirds of all non-synthetic minerals known to man) to provide heaps of essential trace elements.

Grow will assist your plant throughout the vegetative stage, ensuring it develops rapidly and without deficiency. For maximum nitrogen we include loads of insect frass, blood meal and alfalfa meal as well as EM1 infused bokashi bran to further encourage microbial life.

Using Grow from the beginning of the vegetative stage will maximise yield and improve aroma and taste of your plants' flowers whilst ensuring the requirements for additional fertilisers are dramatically reduced. The NPK is similar to the 444 provided by other companies, but has slightly more P.

Mix 3-5 ml per litre of soil (or 1 tablespoon/ gallon) (double this for coco) - ideally 2 weeks before planting. If already planted up, incorporate it as a top dressing: add it to the top of your growing medium and water in well after application. This will provide enough nutrients for 3 to 4 weeks of vegetative growth.


Bloom:
Key ingredients: Organic Bat guano, Organic Scottish Seaweed, Sterilised bone meal, Soybean meal, Mined sulphate of potash.

Nutrient analysis
Total Nitrogen (N) ........2.0%
Phosphorous (P) ……....4.0%
Potassium (K) ……………6.0%

This unique mix has been specifically developed to increase the size, taste and aroma of your photoperiod plant’s flowers plus provide it with enough Nitrogen to stimulate growth during the stretch phase.

The phosphorous and potassium in this blend have been maximised via incorporating seaweed meal, bat guano, wheat bran and mined potassium sulphate. It’s particularly effective in organic cultivation when our Grow mix has been used in the vegetative stage.


I figured amend with the above to try & get through a full run with water only.

However it’s not like I don’t top water the AutoPots anyway so keeping the top of the soil moist to keep the microbes up there active & I’d be adding tea’s too so perhaps top dressing isn't actually an issue a issue, now I think about it


I was trying to be funny regarding the soil EC meter, was a nod to my current method . I’d get my coat, but I no longer have one as I’ve been losing the shirt off my back, these last few months

Thank you for the information, the main reason for this idea was as I am limited on pot size, although I didn’t mention that. I actually figured the layering thing would be common practice, however I’ve never grown in soil before so it’s all still quite alien.

[B1unt]

The plot unthickens…

Sohum state you shouldn’t start seedlings in it, only well rooted plants & Ecothrive state it may be hot for sensitive plants & to cut it with coco for seedlings.

I guess they’re hotter than I was assuming

[supremeweeder]

I am limited in pot size by the containers compatible with the AutoPot system…

I could possibly get around this by running more plants though. The Ecothrive website gives recommendations for a 1.2m² footprint (my tent ) of: 2x 80L pots, 4x 40L pots or 9x 20L pots.

I have 15 & 19L pots, however there is a 25L plastic pot available (as well as a mad 4’x4’ tray system which holds five massive pots that I am not buying ).

Do you think a 19L or 25L pot of straight Ecothrive or Sohum soil would see a plant through an entire cycle - Based on 9x plants, scrogged in a 4’x4’ tent with probably 4 weeks from seed until flip & then 70 days until the chop?


Regarding the amendments Living Soils (living soils fertiliser dot internet) have organic grow Grow & Bloom fertiliser mixes:

Grow:
Key ingredients - EM1 infused bokashi bran, Volcanic rockdust, Mycorrhizal fungi, Alfalfa meal, Mealworm & black soldier fly frass, Wheat bran.

Nutrient analysis
Total Nitrogen (N) .........4.0%
Phosphorous (P) …….....6.0%
Potassium (K) …………….4.0%

In this blend we have added 18 different species of mycorrhizal fungi to assist with reaching and processing all available nutrients in your substrate. We've also added powdered volcanic rockdust (which contains two thirds of all non-synthetic minerals known to man) to provide heaps of essential trace elements.

Grow will assist your plant throughout the vegetative stage, ensuring it develops rapidly and without deficiency. For maximum nitrogen we include loads of insect frass, blood meal and alfalfa meal as well as EM1 infused bokashi bran to further encourage microbial life.

Using Grow from the beginning of the vegetative stage will maximise yield and improve aroma and taste of your plants' flowers whilst ensuring the requirements for additional fertilisers are dramatically reduced. The NPK is similar to the 444 provided by other companies, but has slightly more P.

Mix 3-5 ml per litre of soil (or 1 tablespoon/ gallon) (double this for coco) - ideally 2 weeks before planting. If already planted up, incorporate it as a top dressing: add it to the top of your growing medium and water in well after application. This will provide enough nutrients for 3 to 4 weeks of vegetative growth.


Bloom:
Key ingredients: Organic Bat guano, Organic Scottish Seaweed, Sterilised bone meal, Soybean meal, Mined sulphate of potash.

Nutrient analysis
Total Nitrogen (N) ........2.0%
Phosphorous (P) ……....4.0%
Potassium (K) ……………6.0%

This unique mix has been specifically developed to increase the size, taste and aroma of your photoperiod plant’s flowers plus provide it with enough Nitrogen to stimulate growth during the stretch phase.

The phosphorous and potassium in this blend have been maximised via incorporating seaweed meal, bat guano, wheat bran and mined potassium sulphate. It’s particularly effective in organic cultivation when our Grow mix has been used in the vegetative stage.


I figured amend with the above to try & get through a full run with water only.

However it’s not like I don’t top water the AutoPots anyway so keeping the top of the soil moist to keep the microbes up there active & I’d be adding tea’s too so perhaps top dressing isn't actually an issue a issue, now I think about it


I was trying to be funny regarding the soil EC meter, was a nod to my current method . I’d get my coat, but I no longer have one as I’ve been losing the shirt off my back, these last few months

Thank you for the information, the main reason for this idea was as I am limited on pot size, although I didn’t mention that. I actually figured the layering thing would be common practice, however I’ve never grown in soil before so it’s all still quite alien.

40L is really the minimum if you don't want a lot of work. You might get away with a 25l but don't forget to topdress. I've run autopots outdoors all summer and you'll want plenty of aeration because water is permanently available. this should eliminate the possibility of perched water table stopping your roots thriving. In my experience you'll be better building soil to suit with a higher percentage of aeration, possibly up to 50%. If you add more aeration to bagged soil you'll throw the feed ratio out as bagged soils are preamended. Better to add the amendments yourself to the medium/castings mix them through then get your aeration added. That way you know what is in there is correct. Done like that I didn't have issues with my pots.

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[barney_b]

Granted, I'm currently smoking a grape sugar cookies J, the name supremeweeder cracked me right the hell up.

Cheers
B